Friday, October 3, 2008

Do Italians have black ancestry?

Of course they do. RM wants to have it both ways by claiming non-white blood in Northern Europeans makes them "impure" but black blood in Italians should be ignored.

In fact, Italians have more black blood than Northern Europeans. RM quotes a study by M.B. Richards et al. about "a tiny minority of sequences (approx. =1%) from...sub-Saharan African (L1, L2, L3a and L3b)...clusters appear to have contributed to the European mitochondrial pool within the last few thousand years." What RM fails to mention is, that same studied showed a higher proportion of sub-Saharan lineages in Italy than elsewhere in Europe. RM goes even further and claims "genetic studies demonstrate conclusively that Italians, north and south, have no more black ancestry than any other Western European population." This can be nothing but willful deception on RM's part. Richards reports that:

Two sequences, from Sardinia and Portugal, are members of RFLP haplogroup L2 (confirmed by testing for the HpaI site at position 3592 characterizing L1 and L2 in Africans: Chen et al. 1995). One, from Iberia, is a one-step derivative f the most frequent and widespread member of L3b. An individual from North Germany, one from Britain and one from Sardinia are members of L1, and the 6209±16223±16311 sequence is a member of an African subcluster of L3a, and ndeed is found in a Portuguese subject with Angolan ancestry.

[M. B. Richards et al., Ann. Hum. Genet., 1998]

So, we have two sub-Saharan sequences from Sardinia, one from Germany, and one from Britain. The sample size in Britain is at least 100, vs 49 in Italy. Thus, according to this study, Italians have at least 4 times the Negroid ancestry the British do.

Additionally, as much as RM likes to talk about "Mongoloid" ancestry in Northern Europeans, the only individuals in this study with mtDNA sequences from Asian haplogroup M were "two individuals in the Mediterranean-West and Mediterranean-Central regions". This, even though the study showed "a sampling bias towards the more northerly and westerly extremes of Europe" -- that is, proportionately more samples were collected in NW Europe compared to Southern Europe.

Other research, illustrated for example by table 3 in mtDNA and the Islands of the North Atlantic: Estimating the Proportions of Norse and Gaelic Ancestry, confirms that non-white maternal ancestry is higher in Southern Europe than in Northern Europe. Here is a list of populations, followed by their percentage of "other" mtDNA in parenthesis. "Other" includes both sub-Saharan L lineages and Asian M lineages.

Frequency of M and L mtDNA

Bulgaria/Turkey (2.92%)
France/Italy (2.42%)
Spain/Portugal (1.99%)
Germany (1.14)
England/Wales (.47%)
Scandinavia (.47%)
Scotland (.11%)
Iceland (0%)
Ireland (0%)

Like the Richards study, this data shows that Italians probably have four or more times the amount of non-white maternal ancestry as the English, and they probably have more than 20 times the amount of non-white mtDNA the Irish or Scottish have.

On the paternal side, one Y-chromosome from sub-Saharan haplogroup 8 was detected out of a sample of 10 Sardinians, suggesting a possible substantial Negroid paternal contribution in some areas of Italy. The same study found zero Negroid Y-chromsomes in the British Isles, out of the combined total of more than 600 sampled.

Some people have objected that gene flow between Sardinians and other Italians may be lmiited. This is irrelevant for my purposes. The Sardinians are Italians. If the Sardinians have black ancestry, then one can't claim "Italians don't have black ancestry". In any event, there is ample evidence for black genes elsewhere in Italy.

Do Sicilians have black ancestry?

It should go without saying that, yes, the Sicilians have black ancestry. Again, RM wants us to believe, based on the retraction of one flawed mtDNA study, that Sicilians are "pure" while Northern Europeans are "not pure". Even if there is no trace of sub-Saharan mtDNA in Sicily, that doesn't mean Sicilians have no Negroid ancestry. It seems likely that North African males were one of the main vectors of Negroid gene flow into Sicily. Negroid ancestry in North Africa is largely on the maternal side. So, even if they have a significant sub-Saharan autosomal complement, Sicilians might be left with no sub-Saharan mtDNA markers and few or no sub-Saharan Y-chromosome markers.

In any event, the idea that Sicilians are free of black genes is ridiculous and patently false, as demonostrated by studies like those mentioned on my page about sickle cell. A recent study on mtDNA also confirms the presence of Negroid ancestry on Sicily:

Two haplogroups not common in Europe are present: haplogroup M, separated from Eastern Africa to Western Asia and Eurasia about 50,000 years ago (Quintana-Murci et al. 1999) has been found in Sciacca (8%), Castellammare (3%) and Ragusa (2%); and haplogroup L1/L2 originating from Africa (Watson et al. 1997) has been found in Sciacca (2%) and Castellammare (less than 1%).

[Source: Romano et al. Autosomal Microsatellite and mtDNA Genetic Analysis in Sicily (Italy). Annals of Human Genetics. Volume 67 Issue 1 Page 42 - January 2003.]

Non-European admixture in general

Perhaps more significant than the Negroid ancestry in southern Europeans are their Asiatic and non-European Caucasoid ancestry. From ancient Greek and Roman times (and even before) to the Turkish and Moorish invasions, southern Europe experienced gene flow from North Africa and the Near East. Italy has high levels (by European standards) of non-Caucasoid mtDNA. Italians have 20% Middle Eastern HG9 and 13% North African HG21. Greeks have 28% HG9 and 28% HG21, plus 3% Mongoloid HG26. One recent study even estimated that 85-100% of Greek male lineages are Neolithic (and at least some of those lineages arrived in Greece well after the Neolithic, one expects).

Even given all of the above, Europeans do cluster tightly genetically. While Europeans are all "white", they are not identical, and one can not wish away genetic differences. There is a hierarchy of relatedness. Northwest Europeans are most closely related to other northwest Europeans, and least related to southeast Europeans. NW Europeans are still more closely related to southeast Europeans than they are to non-Europeans, of course.

Photos of Italians

Below are a few examples of racially ambigous southern Italians. These aren't necessarily the most extreme specimens, and I could post dozens more, but these should serve to make the point.

But He is Pure Italian
Benito Mussolini

But What about The Hot Italians

Background information
Birth name Hayden Leslie Panettiere
Also known as Hayden Panettiere
Born August 21, 1989 (1989-08-21) (age 19)
Palisades, New York, United States

Alessandra Mussolini

(1962-12-30)Born December 30, 1962 (age 45)
Rome, Italy

(born December 30, 1962) is an Italian conservative politician, previously an actress and model. She is the leader and founder of the national conservative political party Social Action; since 2003 Mussolini has also been a Member of the European Parliament. Some of Mussolini's noted stances are in regards to social views on women and children's rights and role within both the family unit and society in general

Alessandra Mussolini was born in Rome, the daughter of Anna Maria Scicolone (from Pozzuoli, Province of Naples) and Romano Mussolini, the third son of the Fascist leader Benito Mussolini (from Forlì, Emilia-Romagna). The actress Sophia Loren is her aunt.
I could find more but i wouldn't know if they were pure Italian.

But look how her Pictures have changed


Unlawful_Sign said...

I think that's the biggest bunch of bullshit I have ever heard. Italians were part of the migration to western europe they to were of the Indo european tribe and they split up into 3 groups. (Germanics,Italics,Celtics).

Anonymous said...

i totally diagree with you a little more reasearch might help u because they did studies and found that germens dna is linked to italy

Anonymous said...

Oh, there they go again! A "Nordic" claiming to be racially better than another European group. Well, let me make a little comment . . .

Scandinavians who claim purity are liars. Scandinavians actually have Mongol ancestry. It's a fact, and you cannot change history. So many with slanted blue eyes, flat noses and round faces. MY blog is full of pictures of them in their true light. However, they claim to be superior to others. I'm of German-English heritage, and my German grandmother always told me NEVER to marry a Swede or I'd end up with a very blond Asian-looking baby. So true! True Europeans are superior! NOT phony Nordics! And true Europeans INCLUDE Italians but certainly not Scandinavians!

If you could dish it out, you better be able to take it!

Anonymous said...

You posted pictures of Italians that appear to be something other than European. Should I post pictures of Englishmen who appear to be something other than English? There are blacks all over England. I could post pictures of black Englishmen here and claim that the English are all black because of the pictures I posted. How outrageous!

Northern Europeans - Swedes, Norwegians, Finns, Icelandics and many Germans - most certainly DO have Mongoloid admixture. They are not pure. Europe was invaded by Mongols in the North and Central parts. The Mongol-mix Europeans MOVED to Sweden, Norway, Finland and Iceland. Also, Mongols just "walk over" to Sweden and Norway since it's so damn close. Sweden has the highest Asian DNA than any other Europeans country. There are no pure Nordics! Why are you spreading such lies and garbage?

Sickle Cell is not an indicator of black ancestry. It's indicative of a malaria infested area. SC Disease is a defense against it. Malaria belt was the only place affected with SC Disease. White people obtained different strains of the disease than those in Africa.

This entire blog is so absolutely inaccurate, it's frightening. I cannot believe someone would take so much time filling the internet with such complete and total bull shit.

Think you're supreme? OMG! Get a life! If you had a life, your worries wouldn't be about an intricate drop of black blood in some Sicilian somewhere in the world!

It's laughable!

Tommy said...

First of all this guy is a moron if he actually believes that Romans are originally Nordic people when it is been proven and there is a consensus across all sides of the spectrum that the original inhabitants of the modern day Italian peninsula were descendants from several Italic tribes. They crossed the Alpine trail when migrating to the peninsula but that is irrelevant. The use Unlawful is absolutely correct. Europeans are descendants of several groups from Indo European tribes, but there were a few more than three as far as I am concerned, probably six in total. (The Germanic, Italic, Celt, Baltic, Slavic, Lusitanian) There may be a few in there that I have missed but those are the most significant and account for the ancestors of Eastern and Western Europe. Sicily was invaded frequently throughout history and inhabited by the Arabs from Sub-Saharan Africa however how where does that mean that all of this cross breeding was occurring? The pictures provided here are obviously those who are Arab descended who originally hail from Northern Africa, they're not true Sicilians. Sicilians are a mixture between Greeks (Baltic) and Italic people, plain and simple fact. One other thing too which goes without saying the Portuguese and Spaniards are not part Moor just because of hundreds of years of Arab rule. THEY ARE DESCENDED FROM LUSITANIANS!! IT'S OBVIOUS WHAT YOU ARE BUDDY; A SO CALLED "ARYAN" WHO NEEDS TO GET THE FUCK OFF YOUR HIGH HORSE AND COME BACK TO REALITY AND LAY OFF THE JEALOUSY MY FRIEND!! Italic and Baltic peoples dominated you for centuries and your ancestors were Germanic barbarians, its fine; Nazi Germany made up for it you should be proud of their courage, vision, and intelligence. I mean that with the utmost sincerity and respect the Nazis. Just don’t undermine the original European pioneers because we advanced over a thousand years before “Nordic” people did.

Anonymous said...

Italians are 98% White, the ones that have sub-saharan blood you can tell your self they do, also Germans specially those from southern Germany have a lot of relation with Italians and vise-verse from Roman times, Lombards,Holy Roman Empire....
the ones that have morrish blood are mostly found in Sicily but as i say you can tell they are, also i have discovered that Hollywood always tries to portrait Italians as dark so they hire those with that morrish blood.

Anonymous said...

Aryan are all half breed and part n@#!r so sieg heil Afro puff

Anonymous said...

What a dire blog. There is something seriously wrong with people who spend time thinking and talking about being of a pure or better race.

It makes me think that you're so incapable of making something out of yourself that you have to push others down in order to feel good or/and pretend that just belonging to a certain group- or race- sort of justifies your existence and excuses you from actually doing something that would prove your worth as a human being.

Anonymous said...

I have read many articles on this very subject and MOST Italians are darker than other European peoples. Just do your research if you want to know

Anonymous said...

yes, i do believe most dark Italians have African Ancestry and some will admit it unlike many racist whites

kersley said...

It is a known fact that the Annunaki Gods fashioned us in their image. the first adam were created in a lab eons ago by Enki lord of the waters. this is well documented throughout history.
this was achieved by cross breeding a Homo Erectus with the Annunaki Gods DNA. however the first 7 males and 7 females were not able to procreate. and was allowed to roam free in the eden.
Enki of his lust for the earlings had sex with 2 of the females hybrids. who in turn bore him a son and daughter.(Adapa & Titi) these two were the first civilised humnans whom were able to understand all and whom were in the image of God. Adapa had black hair,smooth skin, his colour was like the clay of the earth. i think it is fair to say he looked like and indian person today?
much later on these indian people inter marry with the original hybrids who was half Annunaki and half homo erectus. That would explain why africans are more robust and have darker skin and course hair.
Enlil, Enki's brother also had a son with the new earhling. he was devasted when the boy was born, he was white as snow, eyes like the blue skies, and hair like the golden beach sand(Albino white people) Enlil was raging mad when he learnt of his new son been this way, non of the Gods had ever seen anything like it. and for that reason they decided to allow it to live, but sent him to a far away land(europe) far from the eden. the rest is history.

this story is extracted from the lost book of enki(zacharia Sitchin)
Douwnload the ebook for free on the web. this is history, the truth. this will fill all the parts that were missing in the Holy bible and make complete sense of it.
Can anyone prove that the Nordics exist? if so how are white people related to them through history?
is there any records saying they came here and created white people? NO It is fact the the Annunaki created all humans on this planet even the albino white man. For you to think you're related to the Nordics. you are so sad and must feel insurcure as a race .the Nordics as i understand are space beings of the future not your pass. know where you come from before you know where you're going.

Anonymous said...

I'm an italian, from Milan (Lombardy), very white skinned, thus with dark hair and eyes. My granny was Blonde, blue eyed, my mom has green Eyes and a very "baltic" face morphology. So I think I'm 100% white, aryan, indoeuropean or wathever you like. I was born blond, and my hair still were blond until I was 4 or 5 years old. My skin refused the sun When I was a child, and still now I can't go on the beach without protection, and I seldom get tanned, more precisely I turn red under the sun.
Well,Having said that I totally AGREE with the post! There are many many italians (doesn't matter the location) which I hardly define as "Whites", or Aryans!
And to be honest, I really laughed when I came across the ITALIAN STORMFRONT Section, in which everybody tries to demonstrate that italians are 100% Whites or Indoeuropeans!! Sometimes just wandering through my Town (which has been heavily colonized by southern italians for over 60 years)I can easily count dozens of True italians (IE not mixed with africans, southern americans, etc....etc..) which can't really be 100% ARYANS, or, better to say Indoeuropeans... But maybe It's just me, it's my problem...I really have difficoulties to consider them just like me...

BlondieWoods said...

OMG, you're an even bigger idiot than I thought.

Those pictures you posted of Italians AREN'T EVEN ITALIANS! They are actors from the Middle East. I know this because they are on the Fasto site! I bet you got those pictures there and are trying to pass them off to prove you lying point. So are you making up lies or are you just the idiot I thought you were?

Anonymous said...

Those pictures you posted of Italians AREN'T EVEN ITALIANS! They are actors from the Middle East. I know this because they are on the Fasto site!

The person who made this blog should be shot speaking this pure bullshit! If it was not for the Italic people you would be living in a mud hut or in a cave, as Italians civilized all of Europe. The Romans didn't make it to India or all the modern day 3rd world countries and so you can see what sort of life and conditions people live in there.

Julius Caesar was shocked at the way the Gauls looked and they were mocked and made fun of by the Romans. We dominated the world and made modern civilization along with the Greeks also. Stop drinking the hateraid you pathetic nordic mongol. WTf has your pathetic people done? Nothing.

evision said...

Anonymous said...

Check you epidemioligical studies. Italians have zero black blood in them. You need to stop listening to propaganda and start listening to the truth.

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Anonymous said...

What sort of extreme bigoted jerkoff would make a thread trying to compare link Italians to blacks. If you want to use psuedo-science and trace the lineage 100,000 years ago then fine. I'm sure you can find black ancestry in just about every homo sapien on the planet in that case. Since blacks have been the object of sheer disdain by almost anyone, especially on these boards, someone has a visceral against Italians now?! Let me inform the white trash douchebags who initiated this bilge!! Italians have succeeded in every profession known to mankind from, art, literature, fashion, fine cuisine, the best and coolest exotic sports and supercars, sports, business, politics, music, arcitecture, etc. etc. I could go on and on about all the great scientists and explorers of Italian heritage as well. Italian civilisation is highly acclaimed by all cultures and will forever be loved and revered by billiones of admirers around the world.

People here mainly have problems with blacks as it has been evident for many years, especially in the U.S. The blacks contribute to numerous problems and plaque are society with a multitude of dreck.

Who cares if some homebody wants to split hairs to see if Italians have a micron of negro DNA?? I don't care. Being Italian is awesome!! Women love me! People love me! People love Italians. And some people like blacks as well. FYI! I have gotten along with some blacks more than most of those of the white trash persuasion!

Anonymous said...

Hayden Panettiere is American, she isn't more Italian, or more beautiful than that dark skinned Italian above her who you suggest has sub-Sarrahan background, which is not necessarily the case, regardless, so called "pure-Italians" don't exist, even Mussolini a fascist knew that, he wanted to make Ethiopians Italian. race to him, like to the ancient Romans was cultural, not genetic

Anonymous said...

i dont know why the issue of italians having black ancestry is so hotly debated. It is a fact. the spaniards too have black ancestry. The moors from africa conquered parts of europe centuries ago. and thanks to one of the posters for enlightening me as to why the Swedes always looked a bit asian to me with their higher cheekbones and somewhat slanted eyes, now I understand because I always wondered.

Anonymous said...

ahh, what a sad state of affairs, Who cares! even if they do have some kind of black gene's in them most people on this planet do as well! so again, Italians might have some black in them, its possible, but not just southern Italians that would definitely include northern Italians as well, here's a simple fact, Italy is a very small country, size wise, hence, it didn't take too much time for people to migrate from southern Italy right up to the north where the so called "white" folk lived, therefore, mixing between so called southern black Italians with northern "white" Italians occurred! very much so throughout history! which would then mean Northern Italians are mixed black as well! and not to mention those Northern Italians who mixed with French, Austrian and Germans, etc! Studies have shown the the percentage of black in southern Italians is not much more then that of northern Europeans, which would include Germans, Austrians and french, etc.

In the end considering the long history of invasion and migration that took place in Europe and the surrounding regions, everyone has a mix of everyone else, point finale!

FYI: The Romans did consider the Africans more civilized and with culture, compared to the Northern Europeans, who the Romans considered barbarians, basically uncultured, dirty, savage and violent..

Anonymous said...

Stop fighting the truth, Italians have black DNA and its so obvious. It's obvious in the skin color and how dark they get with a tan because of the increase amount of melanin in the skin due to black genes, the kinkiness in the hair and the negroid features. Just because some have white skin doesnt mean they are white. There are black people who have white skin because of slavery and the white men procreating with black slaves. If we go by skin color then black people can say they are white also. People forget that there are many races of people with white skin for whatever reason but that doesnt define what you are. DNA does not lie. Stop fighting it. If a million dollars was given to people with black ancestry people would own up to the fact that they have black DNA.

Homo sapiens said...

According to DNA,every human being has African ancestry; it's only a matter of how far back you need to go to find it.
That makes all this irrelevant.
The other thing is I can't understand why people get so offended when it comes to having some black in them; there is no shame to it.
All the stereotypes against black people are very recent historically;the first great civilization was African(Egypt).
I laugh when people say that Greek civilization lunched western civilization without acknowledging that the Greeks learned from the Egyptians.
When the Egyptians built the pyramids,most of the Europeans were living in huts.
Let's all be more humble and know that we are all God's children regardless of our skin color.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous from June 21, 2011: All Italians get "dark" with a tan? They all have a "kinkiness" to their hair? They all have "negroid" features? What ignorance. Have you ever even been to Italy, north, central, and south? As some commentators have mentioned, those who do tan dark, those who do have some negroid features, and those who do have some kinkiness to their hair are (originally) from the deep south, where some mixture with North Africans/S.W. Asians occurred. And as one commentator said, those who DO look more North African/Middle Eastern easily stand out from the rest. Regarding tanning, since southern Europe gets its share of sun in the summer, it's only natural that a higher melanin level would predominate, but that doesn't prove a higher admixture of negroid blood any more than a higher incidence of sickle cell anemia does. Even so, many Mediterraneans in general have light complexions, and do not tan well, including caucasian tribes from Morocco and Tunisia. I am of central Italian, Sicilian, and Greek ancestry; I tan easily on my face and lower arms, but burn anywhere else (perhaps it has something to do with my blue eyes?). In the long run, ALL European groups have at least SOME admixture of non-European blood; trying to (in your case, and the case of the original poster, inaccurately) determine who has the most, and then determine that they are not "white," is ridiculous. And, ultimately, it is racism at its worst, especially when tied in to the bigoted, despicable Aryan master race ideology of Nazis, and those philosophically-related to them.

LEGEND said...

(obvious only Texans who went to UT are of perfect Orange blood *but for Gov Perry, we give this one Aggie admission-----for now**

Anonymous said...

this is bullshit person mad cause we are better than you niggers in Bronxtale Slick hit that nigger off the bike Niggers are gay now and days get a real job

Anonymous said...

Amazin how upset people get when you mention "black". But I noticed blacks don't get upset at being mixed with any other race.

Apple Roof Cleaning Tampa said...

This Blog is very interesting in some ways, but what does it really matter ? The ancient Sumerians lived in the middle east and were Arabs, yet the aliens chose them to breed with. The Egyptians were not white people, yet they built the pyramids.

Giulia said...

LOL... yes, this is the biggest bunch of junk I've read. These studies are so flawed and have agendas. My family is from Northern Italy from the Po Valley. We have a lot of blonds and I look no different than my north German husband. I know people from near Rome with blue eyes and very white skin. The people south of Naples and in Sicily look Greek, but they do not look Sub Saharan African... lol. Good grief, what a bunch of bunk. Get a life and go visit Italy. There is a huge difference between having the ability to make melanin and having melanin in your skin. Italians turn pretty white living in the Northeast of America. I actually burn in the sun, as well as my friend from Rome. We both have very Caucasian/Nordic features and faces. You haven't been to Italy or you'd never say any of this. Also don't look at shows like 'Jersey Shore'... only one person on that show is Italian, the rest are mixed with Africans.

Anonymous said...

Who cares if Italians have a few percentage points of arab or slav . All I care about is the Italian History and the accomplishments and contributions Italians gave to themselves and to the rest of the world. Art,architecture, technology,sports cars,food,wine,strong people!!!!

Anonymous said...

Hi I am half Italian with blood from the south of Italy. I have read this information and I am shocked! Does this mean i have black blood in me? Is there something I can do? Special medications? An operation perhaps?

Arthas said...

You can read this post about Italy and italian people:

Anonymous said...

I think this goes to show u how stupid people really are how people like to keep shit going for no reason at all. If you hate diffrent races of people go kill yourself so you wouldn't have to see them anymore and leave the people who don't mind or care about who is mixed with who or what. We don't need you here this is just another form of hate and dislike. So what if Italians are mixed with black who gives a Fuck there is no pure race of people anymore. So many races of people have intermingled by chose or by force. If you think you are so pure maybe you need to relook you mite find out that you are not.

Kameron said...

I'm Italian, I have a large penis, thus I MUST have Black in me. I concur with this study, niggaz.

Lovinpeace said...

Why is having "black" blood in you a bad thing? Honestly all of our blood is the same color so why does it matter?

Anonymous said...

the problem is not the "color" of the blood but your ignorance!

Anonymous said...

Being black iz the coolest thing on earth to b,i know nothing about the italian heritage,but they r beautiful people,and as far as them having black blood hell they very well look like they do.i sit around and watch tv and i never seen a european race have as much swagg as italians serious look at their hair its damn near nappy like mine but yet again quote on quote "europeans"want no association with the blacks c'mon mane ill acknowledge any peice of non african blood in me hey all the differnt parts of the world and different skin colors ,languages its cool to have many varieties of man,but i must say black is beautiful because melanin never cracks...gone!¡!!¡!!

FERRARI said...


Anonymous said...

My Grandmother, born in 1894) was 100% Scillian. Upon immigration to the U.S., her family settled in the south. There they were listed on census forms as Colored, Mullato or Black. In the south Scillians could not marry whites and were subjected to jim crow laws. My Grandmother married a Black man. Two of my Grandmothers brothers moved to Chicago, where they were recognized as and treated as whites. My Grandmothers Uncle, surname Adovardo, was extremely dark skinned and was not deistinguishable from Blacks...except for his hair. My mtDNA results clearly show hapologroup L0. L1,L2 and L3.

Anonymous said...

Hey, I'm African decent. I'm educated, smart, successful. I know in North America that is hard to swallow and the same goes to my Italian brethren. In movies we can only get certain roles, unfortunately in this society everyone is learning from the screen...let it be sex, politics, race etc Wait....while on topic of race, aren't we all the human race? Oh and I ride a Ducati motorcycle, raced motocross in my younger days...yes ...before James Stewart Jr made it famous! They were many riders of African decent riding before him, so it is not a fad...wooo got some heads spinning now!

Anonymous said...

I read a study that 2 Brits did that showed Italians had LESS sub-saharan blood than the rest of Europe. The amount, though, is so tiny it hardly matters.
Some Italians are darker due to adapting to the climate, not due to mixed blood. Why are people trying to unearth bogus "evidence" that Italians are not full-fledged white people?

Anonymous said...

Hi my fiance is half Italian and half Sicilian, both him and his grandparents do not consider themselves white. They are actually pretty dark and hairy people, they also have very course hair

P.U. Plis said...

Yes, Italians are mixed with black. I will tell you how you can see for yourself. Look up a picture of Downtown Julie Brown who used to be on MTV. She is and very white. Find a picture of her with her husband, Martin Schuermann-also very white. Then look up a picture of their daughter, Gianna Schuermann. And voila! You can see that many white people have black ancestry. My guess is that Italian looking people are about a quarter black and three quarters very white. And it doesn't really matter when the mixing occured because 2 + 3 four hundred years ago still equals 5 today. I'm hispanic...but most of us have Native American heritage which leans us towards Eurasian most of the time. People are just different degrees of the same things, I think. Some are to the highest extreme of white, black or asian...and then there are degrees of being mixed. I think that people should focus more on respecting eachother.

Ms. Iyana Leach said...

Love the humor and FyI Iam African American.

Anonymous said...

Italians are as Nordic as Germans, Norwegians and all the rest of it im Nordic and my people come from northern Italy.

Anonymous said...

What the hell are you talking about you chimp? Italians have less Subsaharan african than French so shut up. You will not become more European taking down S.Europeans, you are a Sudaca.
"Anonymous Sicilian"...get the fuck out idiot.. i have never seen a Sicilian as black as a black,if he was like that he was recently mixed. In Usa it is normal.

Anonymous said... if you have seen Italians with nappy hair like you those were not Italians were immigrants in know the people who come from Africa or Asia or whatever else in Europe?
How can people be that stupid really?
Do you really think that Italians look like black? Frank Sinatra looked black to you?LOL

Anonymous said...

How do you explain the recent finding of neanderthal DNA in white people. That kinda ruins the purity thing doesn't it? What about white skin, light colored eyes and hair -they are mutations according to science because the original humans had dark skin and they have no neanderthal DNA.

Anonymous said...

I just got my results from GENO 2.0 from the National Geographic study. I'm Italian and guess what? I had zero African DNA and I mean ZERO. No northern or sub Saharan. They looked at 150,000 markers. You'd think it would show up. I also had zero Arab ancestry. You'd think that would show up. I'm one European with no traceable African DNA. I have brown hair and eyes. I have straight hair. I have pale skin. Italians are not much different than most other people in Europe. We all have northern and southern European in us. One group were hunter gathers and one were farmers. The two mixed, and the north and south of Europe have a mixture of both. Northern Europeans have East Asian DNA. They don't have 100% northern European DNA. 53% of Denmark is northern European, 30% southern European and 17% southwestern Asian. Southern Europeans are the opposite of that in numbers with southern being 54%, northern at 28% and 17% southeast Asian. Yes, we all have DNA from the northern middle east, from before we moved on to Europe. Even the Swedes have that DNA. Most Europeans came over the Caucus mountains where they hung out for a while and moved into Europe. That is how Italians got there too. Zero markers from Africa. They couldn't even trace me to the original Eve, as my mtDNA lost that lineage. You are very misinformed. I'm not the only Italian in the National Geographic project to have no African DNA. Most of Europe they are finding out does not.

Anonymous said...

I would like to clarify my above post. I meant that everyone in Europe is a mixture of three things... northern European, southern European and southwestern Asian. All of Europe. All have 17% southwest Asian, from when we came from the Caucus mountain area. A person in Denmark would show up with 53% northern Europe ancestry, 30% Southern European Ancestry and 17% southwestern Asian Ancestry. An Italian would be the opposite. Their mixture would be 53% southern European, 30% northern European and 17% southwestern Asian. Finns have 7% East Asian DNA. This Italian had 0% African DNA of any kind. 150,000 markers is an awful lot of marker to find out that I have no African DNA. Most of Europe does not. I had no Arab DNA either. I hope this explains how highly related Europeans are to each other.

Anonymous said...

It is a confirmed fact that Italians, and especially Southern Italian have Sub-Saharan African admixture. See the Dodecad Analysis. This admixture doesn't come from direct mixing with niggers, it rather comes from direct mixing with sand niggers. Sand-Niggers (Middle Easterners and North Africans) are part black. The reason why Jews tend to have very curly hair and pseudo-afro features is on account of mixing with ancient Ethiopian tribes. See the story of the Queen of Sheba. Levantines and other semites also have this assorted negroid admixture.

Jigsaw said...

Italians have negroid blood. Yes, they do.
As a recent study showed:

"...A panel of 52 AIMs was genotyped in 435 Italian individuals in order to estimate the proportion of ancestry from a three-way differentiation: sub-Saharan Africa, Europe and Asia. Structure analyses allowed us to infer membership proportions in population samples, and these proportions can be graphically displayed, as in Figure 2. This analysis indicated that Italians have a basal proportion of sub-Saharan ancestry that is higher (9.2%, on average) than other central or northern European populations (1.5%, on average). The amount of African ancestry in Italians is however more comparable to (but slightly higher than) the average in other Mediterranean countries (7.1%)."

Anonymous said...

Good article mate, its been known for a long time that greeks and italians are not white and aremixed with negro moors and negros from pre indo european tribes. Greeks don't even look white

Anonymous said...

Lol.... I'm just laughing at everything! Everyone is getting do upset over "race". If only people and I do mean the entire human population realized that they are arguing over color. I love people of all sorts. I'm not perfect by any means but nor is anyone else! That is why we have wars all around the world not just in Africa or 3rd world countries. The cold war, Japanese war, Vietnam War, World WarI, World War II, The Cold War, The British Fighting the Spaniards, Vikings fought people, Crusades, The Irish and Brits, The middle East, South American Drug Wars, Sudan , Huttus and Tutsis , American Civil war, Chinese, Korea So forth and so on ...the point is why would you hate someone or not like them simply because their skin color is different. Who the freak cares. If someone of another color does something to you to hurt you than be mad at that person not the entire population of people who have "the same features" because as studies have shown there are more varieties or differences between people of the same color than there are between people of different colors. I have been the subject of racial discrimination and have been called names but people are ignorant and that's what happens. I dont undeestand why someone would want to live their entire life angry and hateful towards others because of a skin complexion difference. It's the biggeat waste of time! I love people and will always continue to love people no matter what their, ethnic, racial or national background.

Anonymous said...

Nick the Greek

The ancient-Greeks placed their colour-tone in the middle, directly between the pale faces of the northernmost Thracians and the burnt faces of the southernmost Ethiopians - Greeks concluded that the Gods adorned them with the absolute best human colourtone.

So Whiteness to the ancient-Greeks was looking Pale, whilst Blackness was looking Burnt.

How imbecilic for the Nordics to reduce Western Civilization down to this!

Western Culture is being systematically eroded by the likes of Afrocentrism, Nordicism, Turkocentrism and FYRoM Style Slavic-centric psuedo-culture with only one Kill-Off Western Culture in order to replace it with theirs - but cultures could replace the Greco-Roman one in all of it's glory, really!

Read This Plebs:

It is crucial that each regional-tribal people-group know their place in the world geographically and their contributions to the world, historically.

When our Western-Partners and European-Cousins downplay the contributions Greeks and Latins made to world-history, they incrementally erode something from the mainstream historical record. Western-peoples owe their enlightenment to the ancient-Greeks and Romans but this is sometimes clouded-over in order to elevate the contributions of the Keltic-peoples and Germannic-peoples.

European history starts way before the Gauls, Franks and [Charlemagne] Karalos Magnos. The beginnings of Germannic history should not be used to cloud-over the history of the Greeks and of the Latins. When the Germans and the Kelts cloud-over Greco-Roman history in order to elevate their own, they erode something from the mainstream historical narrative.

The Western Cultural-Historical Narrative must be preserved...any changes or alterations would see the Turx claiming Trojan descent and South-Slavs claiming Macedonian descent.

When the Kelto-Germannic tribes of Europe attempt to belittle the contributions of the ancient-Greeks and is seen by the Turx and the FYRoM Slavs as free-license to do the same. Classicist Greco-Roman history must be respected by our Kelto-Germannic cousins in order that Turx and South-Slavs do the same.

Macedonians have always been:(i) Greek-speakers,(ii) Hellenic-peoples...those who deny it are by default, anti-Western and anti-Hellenic by extension.

We are now familiar with those who seek to alter the Western Cultural-Historical Narrative - FYRoM and Turkey are known for their attempts at rewriting Western Civilizations earliest recorded history.

FYRoM and Turkey - This pair are best kept at arms a distance, for that same reason.

The Macedonian name is not sharable unless those who seek to share it, recognize and acknowledge the rights and concerns of the Greek-Hellenic people-group that still continue to self-determine in the tradition of their regional historical ancestors.

It goes against the grain...for a Slavic people-group, to usurp the regional-tribal name of a Hellenic people-group.

Academic Reference Points must be upheld and the Western Cultural-Historical Narrative Preserved...Kelto-Germannic peoples must recognize and acknowledge that!

Anonymous said...

This is basically ARYAN and NORDIC propaganda, and trash talk with an agenda, trying to portray Northern Europeans, Germanics and Anglo-Saxons as this totally "Pure" race and the paradigm of beauty for the white race. There is more "non-white" blood in peoples from Sweden and Norway by Mongols and indigenous Inuit's or Eskimo type peoples from Lapland than there is "black" or African blood in any Southern Europeans ! Just what are these racists aspiring to, anyhow ? Northern Europeans have many undesirable racial characteristics, like: pale and alibinoish skin tones,or worse; just like the color of cannned SPAM lunch-meat, bad-hair; and I mean thin, lifeless, yellow and the men are bald by 30 !Gawky and often hunch-back and clumsy bodies, high ugly foreheads, huge pickle noses....and so on ! So, do not believe this garbage and that all Nordic types are so beautiful, while Italians are a race of mulattoes. There is nothing wrong with being bi-racial or of mixed race, however, that is simply not the stuff of facts when talking about Italians, Portuguese, Spaniard or even Turks !In my opinion, and I am neither Italian or of Northern European ancestry, Mediterranean peoples of Southern European are far better looking (on average) than their Northern counterparts.

Anonymous said...

LOL fucking negroes trying to claim italians as black. Get your fact straights you retards, read genetic studies, the only african dna in Italians is in line with Germans and English. The only with a bigger african dna in europe are Iberians. Stop claiming Italian-americans as typical italians too, if you see Italians with nappy hair in usa is because tehy are fucking recently mixed with africans. Bunch of afrocentrist wannabes.